DPChallenge: A Digital Photography Contest You are not logged in. (log in or register
 

DPChallenge Forums >> Web Site Suggestions >> Voting Suggestion
Pages:  
Showing posts 1 - 18 of 18, (reverse)
AuthorThread
02/24/2004 01:40:09 AM · #1
Let me start by saying that what I am about to suggest is just an EXAMPLE of my idea. Please do not castigate the whole idea based on this prototype. (I feel some form of this could be an improvement to the current voting system).

Site Suggestion:

Split the current voting system into two categories, 'Photo Quality' & 'Challenge Merit' (just for example). Both votes would be required and account for 50% (or weighted different perhaps) of the overall score respectively.

(This would mean 'one' additional mouse click)

This voting method would, at the very least, help define where the image is failing (in the eyes of the voting public) in the absence of voter comments.

One could take solace in knowing perhaps, that the photo itself was 'well received', but fell short as it applies to the 'challenge definition' (or vice versa).

Please view graphic example below:



Thanks for listening!
02/24/2004 02:46:14 AM · #2
Originally posted by casualguy:

Both votes would be required and account for 50% (or weighted different perhaps) of the overall score respectively.

This aspect of the issue alone should lead to the most lively debate.

You'd need separate totals for the two categories for the results to be meaningful to the photographer.
02/24/2004 02:53:33 AM · #3
I think 1-10 for challenge merit is a bit OTT. Many people give a 1 2 or 3 on "not meeting the challenge" even if the photo is worthy of a 10 (myself included). Using this method, if I gave the photo quality a 10, even if I give a 1 on meeting the challenge, it would only give out a minimum 5.5 average. Different people weight different percentages of their score on meeting the challenge. I think a simple Yes/No box for meeting the challenge, which didnt have any effect on score, would let people know if this was why their score was plummeting. It could be default checked to neither so that people who didnt want to click twice wouldn't have to.

02/24/2004 03:10:14 AM · #4
so instead of going through 400+ pics voting and commenting you suggest we vote twice??

i dont think its gonna catch on
02/24/2004 03:44:40 AM · #5
I think this has merit, and lots of it.

However, I would propose the following slight modification original suggestion to the : the "Meets the Challenge" button could be a binary decision.

If you don't think the entry meets the challenge, one click and the quality score gets divided by two (note: I spent last night looking at "mundane" entries where many people interpretted "making something look extraordinary" as a very low hurdle to get over. Rather than score everyone a "1", I ignored the challenge all together and started scoring as if it was an open subject.)

The report could give back two scores: actual score and points lost do to not meeting the challenge (which you could then total together if you wanted to know what your score could have been by following the rules.)

The other thing I thought of that might help is some check box comments:
Sharper, Too Dark, Too Sharp, Colors are off, ...., "Dude, time for a new hobby."

A simple little report that said "30% of the public thinks your picture is too dark" might be helpful.

Bill M.

P.S. Come to think of it, a note that said "30% of the public thinks you need a new hobby" might be educational as well.
02/24/2004 08:04:08 AM · #6
I think Bill is on the right track.

Keep our voting EXACTLY the same... BUT add check boxes for:
[list]
[*] Does no meet challange.
[*] Too dark.
[*] Too washed out.
[*] Too sharp
[*] Too blury
[*] ...
[/list]

You get the idea... These would be COMPLETLY optional and woulf really help seeing as how people are too scared to leave actual comments (see my post on anonymous comments).
02/24/2004 08:38:22 AM · #7
The idea of having optional feedback checkboxes that can be marked "anonymously" appeals to me. I'd like to see a list of checkboxes that people think would be helpful. I think they should be divided up in to two categories: "positives" and "negatives". Another thing to consider: should certain "opinions" be enforced as "radio buttons" (where only one choice could be selected) so somebody couldn't select "too dark"/"too light" (for example) at the same time?

I envision a summary report that would show something like:

208 users ranked your image.
8 users left a comment.
112 users provided feedback:
Does not meet challenge: 5 (4.4%)
Too dark: 12 (10.7%)
etc.

If we can put together a decent, well-thought-out list (and by that I mean it needs to be specific enough to be helpful but general enough to avoid having 100 options), I'll pull everything together and present the idea to the admins in the Site Council forum.
02/24/2004 08:44:08 AM · #8
Originally posted by EddyG:

The idea of having optional feedback checkboxes that can be marked "anonymously" appeals to me. I'd like to see a list of checkboxes that people think would be helpful. I think they should be divided up in to two categories: "positives" and "negatives". Another thing to consider: should certain "opinions" be enforced as "radio buttons" (where only one choice could be selected) so somebody couldn't select "too dark"/"too light" (for example) at the same time?

I envision a summary report that would show something like:

208 users ranked your image.
8 users left a comment.
112 users provided feedback:
Does not meet challenge: 5 (4.4%)
Too dark: 12 (10.7%)
etc.

If we can put together a decent, well-thought-out list (and by that I mean it needs to be specific enough to be helpful but general enough to avoid having 100 options), I'll pull everything together and present the idea to the admins in the Site Council forum.


This would be great!!! I love the idea.
02/24/2004 08:46:42 AM · #9
I am totaly in agreement that something like this needs to be done!!!
However, I am leaning towards Russell2566 idea!
I think that this would be incredibly useful!
Just my two cents!
02/24/2004 08:52:17 AM · #10
If there was to be a 'too dark' check box could I have a 'calibrate your monitor' reply button.
02/24/2004 09:32:08 AM · #11
It's easy to check if a person has voted on any images yet.

If they have not yet voted they should be forced to view a monitor calibration screen!!!
02/24/2004 09:40:46 AM · #12
I think check boxes might encourage us all to make less comments.

If a photo doesn't meet the challenge, I also give it a 1, even if it's the greatest photo I've ever seen. Otherwise, why set parameters at all?

But again, if I believe a photo doesn't fit the challenge, I should tell the person that in the comments section (which I usually fail to do)
02/24/2004 10:01:53 AM · #13
Originally posted by hopper:

I think check boxes might encourage us all to make less comments.

If a photo doesn't meet the challenge, I also give it a 1, even if it's the greatest photo I've ever seen. Otherwise, why set parameters at all?

But again, if I believe a photo doesn't fit the challenge, I should tell the person that in the comments section (which I usually fail to do)


This would be great if people were actualy leaving comments. Only the top photos get comments.

I'd rather
(place crappy and get lots of comments)
OR
(place well and get few comments)

Message edited by author 2004-02-24 10:02:14.
02/24/2004 10:41:38 AM · #14
Originally posted by hopper:

I think check boxes might encourage us all to make less comments.

I don't know if that would necessarily be the case.

A lot of the comments that people leave are just the "nice shot" or "well done" type comments that don't touch on the actual elements of the composition. Although those type of comments are great to receive, they aren't technically (from a photographic/composition standpoint) "helpful".

By having the ability to quicly and easily mark off certain "opinions" about the entry, I think you may actually receive more insight into the "voting mind". And not just helpful to the submitter, but also to everyone else when they review the challenge results. For example, I will look at a shot and think to myself "that looks oversharpened to me". For me, it would be interesting to see how many other people also feel that way, and having an "Oversharpened" checkbox could facilitate that.

(And of course, the ability to continue to leave personal, non-anonymous, typed-out comments would still be available to those who want to use it.)

Message edited by author 2004-02-24 10:45:57.
02/24/2004 10:42:33 AM · #15
less comments, but probably more feedback. It will be generic feedback, but still feedback. Could still leave more personal comments, right? Worth thinking about, maybe trying out for a challenge or two.

Perhaps the anonymity could be removed? If I check a box, couldn't a comment be posted somewhat like it is now (with the text of the box or boxes I checked appearing in the comment)? This would then be a shortcut for the most common comments. I know some people want anonymous comments, and more people may comment if they are anonymous, but there is something to be said for standing behind your comments...at least as far as the integrity of the comments.
02/24/2004 05:57:59 PM · #16
Originally posted by Russell2566:

I think Bill is on the right track.

Keep our voting EXACTLY the same... BUT add check boxes for:
[list]
[*] Does no meet challange.
[*] Too dark.
[*] Too washed out.
[*] Too sharp
[*] Too blury
[*] ...
[/list]

You get the idea... These would be COMPLETLY optional and woulf really help seeing as how people are too scared to leave actual comments (see my post on anonymous comments).


I had posted this example (shown below) a few weeks ago but removed it upon quick critisim. I think it somewhat represents what you are suggesting as well.



(Again, some form of this example could be useful)
02/24/2004 06:09:21 PM · #17
Originally posted by GeneralE:

Originally posted by casualguy:

Both votes would be required and account for 50% (or weighted different perhaps) of the overall score respectively.

This aspect of the issue alone should lead to the most lively debate.

You'd need separate totals for the two categories for the results to be meaningful to the photographer.


So who wins ? The most on topic, or the best picture ?

Personally, I find voting arduous enough, without adding an extended variety of extra button clicks.

It doesn't add one more mouse click - it adds at least 2 more per image, never mind the actual effort of coming up with different scores. (you click a number it advances now, with split voting you'll have to click at least two scores and an enter)

I think what it would do is reduce the already dwindling number of votes that are cast each challenge.

Something that was previously suggested that I think would both increase the quality and quantity of feedback would be some sort of eliminator rounds during voting. Sites like betterphoto and digitalphotocontest both do this quite successfully (there are issues with other parts of the process, but thats for another discussion)

There are often, particularly in the open challenges, a large chunk of images that are rubbish (in the eyes of the aggregated voting group)

Wading through those to find the images that are actually worth commenting on is increasingly depressing - those bad images aren't getting any help, (beyond the masses of tutorials, wealth of information and pointers to basic photography instruction available on this site) and it is doubtful that anything in a short comment would actually improve them significantly. Perhaps a rude reply might shock the entrant into seriously bothering to look at the picture, but even that seems doubtful- rather more likely would be an indignant 'I'm a misunderstood genius' post to the rant forum.

So I'd suggest dropping them after the first few days of voting. The score is low, you know people don't like the picture, it isn't likely to magically jump up to a 6 given more days voting. It also isn't likely to gain some deeply insightful comments that would dramatically change the photographers output.[ sorry - but its true ]

Then the middle of the pack and good pictures are more likely to get more comments. The high scoring images are going to get lots of comments anyway - that won't change, but maybe the images in the middle, that typically get the least comments will get some more.

The lower scoring images aren't much or any worse off, the best images still get the same, but maybe the people in the middle, who might most benefit from a short comment (with the assumption that the images in the middle are typically not terribly bad, but could be improved with smaller suggestions) get the help they need.



Message edited by author 2004-02-24 18:31:41.
02/24/2004 06:15:33 PM · #18
Well it would give photographers more feedback they they are currently getting. The other way would be to have a toggle box that says "meets current challenge" then times a 1-5 number by 1 (not meet challenge) or 2 (does meet challenge topic)

Still I am not sure the most or even any people vote like that. It would serve however to make higher scores higher and lower scores lower. I am not sure if that is something we would want as well.

Originally posted by casualguy:

Let me start by saying that what I am about to suggest is just an EXAMPLE of my idea. Please do not castigate the whole idea based on this prototype. (I feel some form of this could be an improvement to the current voting system).

Site Suggestion:

Split the current voting system into two categories, 'Photo Quality' & 'Challenge Merit' (just for example). Both votes would be required and account for 50% (or weighted different perhaps) of the overall score respectively.

(This would mean 'one' additional mouse click)

This voting method would, at the very least, help define where the image is failing (in the eyes of the voting public) in the absence of voter comments.

One could take solace in knowing perhaps, that the photo itself was 'well received', but fell short as it applies to the 'challenge definition' (or vice versa).

Please view graphic example below:



Thanks for listening!
Pages:  
Current Server Time: 03/28/2024 05:57:27 PM

Please log in or register to post to the forums.


Home - Challenges - Community - League - Photos - Cameras - Lenses - Learn - Prints! - Help - Terms of Use - Privacy - Top ^
DPChallenge, and website content and design, Copyright © 2001-2024 Challenging Technologies, LLC.
All digital photo copyrights belong to the photographers and may not be used without permission.
Current Server Time: 03/28/2024 05:57:27 PM EDT.