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05/03/2007 01:07:34 AM · #1 |
....well actually my title says it all, and before anyone hollers at me i know that there are alot of people who give great constructive feedback.
I dont mind getting a low score...i have no delusions about my talent but my april free study is sitting at 4.4 and ZERO comments...If it's that bad can someone at least tell me why? |
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05/03/2007 01:12:43 AM · #2 |
| I usually comment on my favourites and also on the lowest scoring ones. I try to be constructive, but sometimes I just dont like a shot and dont really know why. I usually try to say why as I dont think it is fair to just say YUK. If there is a shot that I would have rated higher but didn't because of one think I usually say so. I would love to comment more but dont really have the time. I also dont get a great deal of comments but love the ones I get whether good or bad. I always try to let the commentor know that I appreciate it by PM. |
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05/03/2007 01:12:45 AM · #3 |
Originally posted by smardaz:
....well actually my title says it all, and before anyone hollers at me i know that there are alot of people who give great constructive feedback.
I dont mind getting a low score...i have no delusions about my talent but my april free study is sitting at 4.4 and ZERO comments...If it's that bad can someone at least tell me why? |
Be patient! most people vote 1st because its so much and comment later. It's still early |
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05/03/2007 01:19:07 AM · #4 |
| Hmm; this has just sparked a web-site suggestion in my mind. How about having the last weeks users to makethe most helpful comments listed on the front page. This could be an incentive for users to do those extra few comments. |
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05/03/2007 01:19:41 AM · #5 |
I like to get comments, but most of the times it bums me out, (when I get a bad one) especially when I try really hard on a chalenge.
I don't really like to give bad comments, I don't want to hurt anyones feelings and not everyone sees things the same way (in their photos).
I at least try to be fair.
If i love a photo, I tell em'. :) |
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05/03/2007 01:20:10 AM · #6 |
Originally posted by dmadden:
Originally posted by smardaz:
....well actually my title says it all, and before anyone hollers at me i know that there are alot of people who give great constructive feedback.
I dont mind getting a low score...i have no delusions about my talent but my april free study is sitting at 4.4 and ZERO comments...If it's that bad can someone at least tell me why? |
Be patient! most people vote 1st because its so much and comment later. It's still early |
yeah thats what i do, i go through and vote then later in the week i go back and leave comments. Sometimes though i comment on the spot first time through. But from my entry history my least commented shots were in the 4-5.3 range. Just average shots, they don't command alot of attention or comments. |
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05/03/2007 01:55:40 AM · #7 |
Originally posted by jsc9306:
I like to get comments, but most of the times it bums me out, (when I get a bad one) especially when I try really hard on a chalenge.
I don't really like to give bad comments, I don't want to hurt anyones feelings and not everyone sees things the same way (in their photos).
I at least try to be fair.
If i love a photo, I tell em'. :) |
I have to say that I'm currently getting hammered on my triptych entry, 13 comments on the focus issue, which prompted my post on the rant page - BUT - they're right! And as much as it might suck to have to hear it, every one of those comments, even the ones that aren't padded, are useful, as they continue to hammer home the essentials.
So I say bring it. That's why I'm here.
I try to leave comments, and do pretty well for a while, but I do find leaving critical comments kind of spiritually draining, so I generally stop after a bit. |
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05/03/2007 01:56:48 AM · #8 |
Originally posted by smardaz:
....well actually my title says it all |
imho too many negative rants on commenting is discouraging feedback... also, why in the world do we need a "how to leave comments" advise???
Message edited by author 2007-05-03 01:57:13. |
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05/03/2007 02:01:26 AM · #9 |
Originally posted by crayon:
Originally posted by smardaz:
....well actually my title says it all |
imho too many negative rants on commenting is discouraging feedback... also, why in the world do we need a "how to leave comments" advise??? |
im not trying to tell anyone how to leave comments, just that the whole idea is to improve your art/hobby but hard to do that with no feedback |
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05/03/2007 02:12:00 AM · #10 |
I've found that random comments from people I don't know are little help in general anyway.
There are a few that seem to always leave great feedback - but out of hundreds of photos, what are the odds.
I've found a better way is to develop a relationship with photographers that I look up to - some of them are "real" relationships with "real" people (non-DPC). That way I know I'm going to get great feedback, even if it hurts - cause they want to help me be better.
So why enter a challenge? Well, there's the purdy ribbon - and I just like to share. :) |
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05/03/2007 02:30:56 AM · #11 |
Originally posted by smardaz:
....well actually my title says it all, and before anyone hollers at me i know that there are alot of people who give great constructive feedback.
I dont mind getting a low score...i have no delusions about my talent but my april free study is sitting at 4.4 and ZERO comments...If it's that bad can someone at least tell me why? |
The problem with commenting during challenges is that the commenter never really knows who is receptive to constructive criticism. Its a crap shoot for commenters at best.
If you want comments just post your image in the Individual Photograph forum after voting closes and ask for feedback. There will be plenty of people not too bashful to tell you exactly what they think is wrong with it. ;)
Your score is really your most revealing comment. When you get a low score then study the top finishers and honestly ask yourself what those pictures have that yours doesn't to better understand how to get a higher score. Then apply that learning in future submissions.
Many comments you get are from people who know little more about photography than you probably do, so most comments have limited or cryptic value. You are better off being more self-reliant to study good examples to improve your photography than to depend on other's off-hand remarks.
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05/03/2007 02:46:21 AM · #12 |
Originally posted by digitalknight:
I've found a better way is to develop a relationship with photographers that I look up to - some of them are "real" relationships with "real" people (non-DPC). That way I know I'm going to get great feedback, even if it hurts - cause they want to help me be better.
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I actually have done that with a few whos work i really enjoy, that is good advice |
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05/03/2007 03:06:56 AM · #13 |
Originally posted by smardaz:
Originally posted by crayon:
Originally posted by smardaz:
....well actually my title says it all |
imho too many negative rants on commenting is discouraging feedback... also, why in the world do we need a "how to leave comments" advise??? |
im not trying to tell anyone how to leave comments, just that the whole idea is to improve your art/hobby but hard to do that with no feedback |
sorry, wasn't pointing at you. lately there has been some rants in the forums from unhappy photographers complaining about the comments they received on their images. imho these sort of rants, eventually would discourage people from leaving comments for fear of hurting other's feelings. |
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05/03/2007 06:34:45 AM · #14 |
When I first started actively at DPC I was very conscientious about commenting along with voting, with the idea that I could help people see what I saw and how they might achieve the result they wanted for someone like me, or what it was in particular I liked about a shot. I don't really do that anymore. Why not?
1. Some of my shots went to the end of challenges with minimal comments, indicating to me that my conscientiousness was not a shared value of the majority of users on the site;
2. I got some negative pms from people on whose shots I had made comments that were clearly labeled as my opinion (not as some objective fact)
3. I realized some people were playing for the brown; I am not sharp enough to be certain a shot I've commented on is trying this, and would be loathe to insult someone who was trying for a blue by suggesting they were trying for the brown, so I was wasting comment time on people who were trying to achieve something other than what I was commenting on.
I am much more in favor of Dr. Achoo's "request a comment" threads following challenges (others do this as well), or the individual photograph threads after. I also have started to look at shots that I rated highly during voting that have not done well in terms of challenge placement. I may then go and give that shot an after-challenge comment, indicating my vote, explaining why I liked the shot, and trying to see why others might not have. Thus, it's positive feedback (I rated your shot highly and am surprised it didn't do better) plus some hopefully constructive observations. Given that we can order challenge results by our vote when we view them, it's pretty quick to pick a few and do this after a challenge.
Steve's suggestion for self-criticism is a good one, but sometimes there is only so far you can go in analyzing your own shots, even weighing them against the top shots in a challenge. It helps to have someone tell you the shot is not as sharp as you think it is, or that it is darker than you think it is, or the selective desat didn't have the effect you wanted. Sometimes the things that make our shots not "work" here on DPC are things we liked and specifically chose to do, but when that vision is not shared by the voters, we sometimes need them to tell us that for us to see it, no matter how open we are and how self-critical we are.
One thing I always suggest when I see these threads: join a side project. There always seems to be one underway. You don't get votes, but you will get comments, especially if you spend time commenting on other thread participants' shots. And there is often a treasure trove of knowledge shared among those who participate in something in which there is a shared interest.
Just my thoughts.
Rob
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05/03/2007 06:50:15 AM · #15 |
Originally posted by PaulE:
Hmm; this has just sparked a web-site suggestion in my mind. How about having the last weeks users to makethe most helpful comments listed on the front page. This could be an incentive for users to do those extra few comments. |
I quite like this idea actually.
Just something to give a bit of incentive to people to comment.
*Edit* I'd just like to say that i've started participatin in the b+w challenge of may, and have added a few shots to my portfolio and have recieved over 30 comments in a few days, which is just fantastic. So I don't think it's the people at DPC's laziness, just that there are hundreds and hundreds of photos all wanting comments. I think the more you participate and get out there, the more comments you'll get.
Message edited by author 2007-05-03 07:01:51. |
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05/03/2007 07:27:27 AM · #16 |
| I get the distinct feeling that many people do not want negative constructive comments. I have tried written "helpful" comments on photos I thought could be better, and many are not checked off as helpful. I, myself, have found many negative comments that I have received to be extremely helpful, and I welcome negative constructive comments. I agree with Dr. Achoo also. There should be a little icon by photos that want negative constructive comments, and I would feel free to give my opinions. |
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05/03/2007 08:17:51 AM · #17 |
Originally posted by cloudsme:
There should be a little icon by photos that want negative constructive comments, and I would feel free to give my opinions. |
Agree whole-heartedly - I would certainly check such a box, and would feel far more inclined to put effort in to comments and suggestions for those photographs that I felt could be improved. |
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05/03/2007 08:58:04 AM · #18 |
Comments shouldn't be about the rewards as the giver.
Some people will appreciate comments received, others might not even look at them. I'll admit I find it interesting at times what some people mark as helpful vs not marking at all, especially when the comments have been checked selectively for a single image (i.e. - all the atta boys helpful, anything critical not).
In the end I think that if you are a person inclined to make comments, make them. It is helpful in training your own eye toward photography. So what if people don't like them, don't check them, or even send you a nasty PM. Just shrug it off. Perhaps even a chuckle with the shrug is even better. :D
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05/03/2007 12:06:18 PM · #19 |
| i am all about criticism i'm not trying to geet my ego stroked i just want to be better. and i have joined my second 30 day challenge (the b&w) so the point is well taken |
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05/04/2007 12:29:34 PM · #20 |
| I have spent the last couple of days voting on the current challenges, and have worked hard at trying to leave meaningful comments. I shaln't be leaving any more 'though, as I have just received an e-mail attacking me for what I said in one. I certainly did not intend to cause any offence, and having re-read what I wrote, I would still stand by it, although I will remove the comment. I had thought I was doing my bit, but the result has ended up making me feel very miserable - and presumably also the person who I have clearly offended. |
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05/04/2007 12:34:50 PM · #21 |
Originally posted by SaraR:
I have spent the last couple of days voting on the current challenges, and have worked hard at trying to leave meaningful comments. I shaln't be leaving any more 'though, as I have just received an e-mail attacking me for what I said in one. I certainly did not intend to cause any offence, and having re-read what I wrote, I would still stand by it, although I will remove the comment. I had thought I was doing my bit, but the result has ended up making me feel very miserable - and presumably also the person who I have clearly offended. |
Don't let one bad apple spoil the bunch. If they are too thin-skinned to appreciate you good intentions, than that's their problem. Rest assured that the vast majority of people that you don't hear from actually do find value in your comments and let that good feeling outweigh any negativity that the unhappy few send your way. |
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05/04/2007 12:46:52 PM · #22 |
Originally posted by smardaz:
i am all about criticism i'm not trying to geet my ego stroked i just want to be better. |
Yes - this is what it's all about. Everybody needs some sort of validation for what they do, and of course when somebody says "wow great photo" it gives you the warm fuzzies, but really, are you going to become a better photographer because of comments like these? I would much rather have somebody pick it apart. I guess as a graphic designer I'm used to this, but some people have a hard time separating themselves from their work, understandably, and see criticism as a personal attack. |
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05/04/2007 12:47:37 PM · #23 |
Originally posted by SaraR:
... I shaln't be leaving any more 'though, as I have just received an e-mail attacking me for what I said in one. |
That's a bummer about the PM coming back your way.
Question. Would you quit submitting photos to challenges if you rec'd a negative comment? Probably not. Same for giving comments. Don't let one negative reaction ruin what you enjoy. If you enjoy giving comments, then continue to do so.
If this is still something you're not comfortable with, switch over to baghead status and you won't get the negative PM immediately, they'll just come after voting. :P Maybe the recipient will have had a chance to cool down by then...
Just my 2 cents. :) |
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05/04/2007 01:12:44 PM · #24 |
My stats:
Comments given: 10,385
Comments received: 4,308
And the reasons my comments received is that high are side challenges and Team Suck support. Not a lot of those comments received are during challenges. To get more, make more. Doesn't always work, but at least other people will get more comments!!
Message edited by author 2007-05-04 14:12:11. |
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05/04/2007 02:03:22 PM · #25 |
I rather enjoy giving comments..
Mainly just to people who need help, though.
If your photo doesn't need help but isn't quite amazing enough for people to go "wow" than you probably won't get alot of comments.
Just what I've seen around..
Not always the case.
=P |
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