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01/17/2005 12:40:18 PM · #1 |
After finishing voting on all 531 images in this challenge I wonder how others feel about this first ever of it's type DPC challenge?
These were my thoughts:
1-There is an amazing range of creativity and quality in the images from simple snapshot to top notch award winner and everything in between.
2-Overall general quality is very good.
I speculate this is due to a larger DPC membership, improved camera equipment and improved post processing skills by DPC members. All are good things.
3-There are numerous images entered that I had seen before.
These images were posted on DPC and other places thoroughtout the year that were never entered into challenges until now but were posted for various reasons. Mine was among them. I processed it for the March Free Study, but never submitted it. It was not submitted because I did not think it was good; I do, but because I thought it would not be acceptable to voters. This was it's second chance.
4-The incredible variety of techniques used and quality in images (I rated 125 at 7 or greater in my first pass) made it hard to properly rate them.
5-Some images evoke the question... How do you come up with such creative ideas?
6-Some images evoke the question... How do you create such technically perfect photographs?
7-Some images evoked the question... Why submit such a poor quality image?
8-Other images evoked the question... How could you take such a great concept and do it so poorly?
9-Overall the range of quality in images makes it a very interesting challenge.
10-It is hard to predict the top 10, let alone the top 3 but that will not keep me from trying. That is one way we learn. :)
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01/17/2005 12:44:34 PM · #2 |
I think I was spoiled by Bokeh which I thought had a unusually high proportion of images I liked.
I have only done my first draft voting (at least two further passes through will be done in coming days)...
Although there are plenty of images I think are good and a few I think are excellent I am surprised how many images I am rating at 5 or below. Really, a lot evoking the question "Why would you enter this into a competition of the best of an entire year?".
I know that sounds harsh but I am surprised that some of the entries were entered at all...
That said there are some images I am really enjoying.
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01/17/2005 12:46:58 PM · #3 |
Good points.
I dont even want to try and predict the top 10. I am pretty sure that they will mostly be ones that I thought were boring. With one or 2 exceptions. The ones I gave 10's to may not be the "prettiest" but they stir me up more than the others.
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01/17/2005 12:52:06 PM · #4 |
Over all I thought the quality is nice! I have not seen all of them yet, so I can't comment on all but heres a few of my thoughts...
1. Sooo many fake blue, overprocessed skys, that really ruin a great shot.
2.Ilike to burn and dodge a bit here and there, and I LOVE black and white for certain shots...but many of the entries were WAY overprocessed, and fake looking.(thats just my personal opinion.)
3. There are some AWESOME shots in this challenge, and I am way underskilled, and overmatched in technically flawless photography.
4.Last but not least, I have been voting much more lately, and a thumbnail can REALLY make a decent picture look AWESOME, or it can make an AWESOME picture look just decent.
Great Job, and Good luck!
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01/17/2005 12:52:47 PM · #5 |
I thought the standard was very high for the majority of the shots. However I did think that there were photographs entered that fell below the standard of 'your best photo'. I myself did not enter because I did not have anything I considered good enough. I have voted on all of the entries but need to go back through and adjust voting on some of them.
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01/17/2005 12:52:59 PM · #6 |
I'm so unhappy with my photo...that's all.
2005 will be better...
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01/17/2005 12:56:05 PM · #7 |
Originally posted by thatcloudthere:
I'm so unhappy with my photo...that's all.
2005 will be better... |
I on the other hand am VERY happy with my photo,,,,,, its the scores that make me want to......(boo hoo hoo,,,,,,waaaaaaaaaa)... oops sorry. I'm ok,,,,,,,honest. hehehee |
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01/17/2005 12:57:44 PM · #8 |
I think some of the best photos I took in 2004 were on film (including Tomboy, my best selling print, click on the link in my signature, which is on sale to raise funds for wildlife conservation). So I couldn't enter those.
I'm not unhappy about the one I entered, I like it a lot, but I didn't have high hopes for it in terms of a high score. Infact it's scoring better than I expected though we'll see how the score changes over the rest of the voting period.
I did feel it was at least good enough not to be considered inappropriate in a BEST OF... challenge.
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01/17/2005 12:57:51 PM · #9 |
I was surprised at all the very mediocre shots. Landscape photos taken at what looks like noon, personal shots of people's children (why am I looking at this) etc. really make me scratch my head. I thought the same: if this is your best photo of the year, there's something wrong. Certainly at one point in time over a year a photographer with any self respect is going to set up a few carefully considered shots and process them well. Either this is not the case, or some people aren't submitting their best work. I suspect the former. A few of them looked like someone jsut ran onto the street, snapped without looking, and then uploaded.
I did give a lot of sevens and eights, but I only have seven 10s. Not a whole lot really moved me.
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01/17/2005 01:20:21 PM · #10 |
Originally posted by jimmythefish:
I was surprised at all the very mediocre shots. Landscape photos taken at what looks like noon, personal shots of people's children (why am I looking at this) etc. really make me scratch my head. I thought the same: if this is your best photo of the year, there's something wrong. Certainly at one point in time over a year a photographer with any self respect is going to set up a few carefully considered shots and process them well. Either this is not the case, or some people aren't submitting their best work. |
"Best" is an elusive term, with different meaning to different people. For some it will be perfect composition. lighting, and focus on a still-life. For others, it will be capturing a poignant candid on the street -- the emotional engagement over-riding any technical deficiencies.
Basically, to throw them in all together is simple, but does them all a disservice by forcing unnatural comparisons. If we do this again, I think we should provide categories into which people enter their photo, but we'd be limited to one entry overall. Then we'll at least be comparing landscapes to landscapes, portraits to portraits, etc.
I think this is somewhat less of a problem with the "regular" Free Study challenges, since those are prospective, and not selected from past shots. Might be interesting to try it once, though I don't know about generating so many more ribbons ... |
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01/17/2005 01:25:32 PM · #11 |
I think there are a lot of great photos in this catagory... I've only had the chance to vote on 23 of them (I've got my work cut out for me) so I really have a lot more to see!
What I want to know, is why my entry is doing so poorly. I really wish someone would comment (I have no comments yet). I'd really like to know what I need to do to improve! It's really hard to learn and grow when I don't know why my entry is doing so poorly! |
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01/17/2005 01:28:09 PM · #12 |
I'd tend to disagree that 'best' is elusive on this site. If you're considering art, then yes, but but as this is a challenge website it should be interpreted as the shot which you think will score the best in the challenge. As someone who submitted a shot of your child (I think) you may have an emotional connection to that shot, but I certainly don't. Biases must be discarded to consider a shot which will have mass appeal. This isn't art, this is competition.
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01/17/2005 01:35:03 PM · #13 |
I have voted on all of the images and have commented on 127 (24%, so far) of them. I'm finding the same things you all are...
- There are some really well thought out and executed shots.
- There are a ton of overprocessed shots. I find that I like natural shots best. I do like some things that have been processed but people seem to get easily carried away and don't know when enough is enough.
- Like James, I found several images that people just snapped without thinking...or perhaps even moving their feet to get a better vantage point. I find it hard to believe that anyone could think some of these images are even close to being good.
- There were images with subjects that were completely ordinary and/or uninteresting. I will add that ordinary subjects can be good, or even great, if someone has thought about the execution and done something unique to set it apart from the rest.
- The majority of images seem to be average. Average for me meaning, they are alright, could use some work, and don't move me at all or much. I have 107 rated at 4, 147 rated at 5, and 194 rated at 6. While I don't have many 2's or 3's (no 1's) I wasn't afraid to dish them out if deserved. I will be tweaking a few votes over the next weeks.
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01/17/2005 01:38:13 PM · #14 |
Originally posted by jimmythefish:
I'd tend to disagree that 'best' is elusive on this site. If you're considering art, then yes, but but as this is a challenge website it should be interpreted as the shot which you think will score the best in the challenge. As someone who submitted a shot of your child (I think) you may have an emotional connection to that shot, but I certainly don't. Biases must be discarded to consider a shot which will have mass appeal. This isn't art, this is competition. |
I agree. People are attached to images they take. A moment or object that may have great impact on the photographer may not have any impact on the viewer.
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01/17/2005 01:39:09 PM · #15 |
Originally posted by stdavidson:
There is an amazing range of creativity and quality in the images from simple snapshot to top notch award winner and everything in between. |
Speaking of snapshots, I've been wondering how people define that term here. I've recieved a few comments that imply that the commenters define a snapshot simply as something that is unedited or unconstructed (constructed being posed shots, studio set ups, etc.). Do people really feel that an interesting capture is a snapshot, just because it required no setup? I've been searching dictionaries for a definition but all I got was "A photograph taken with a small hand-held camera" and "casual photograph". The hand held camera one just seems stupid...I don't think your equipment defines a snapshot, and casual photograph seems vague. Before joining the site, I think I would have defined a snapshot as the sort of posed line up shots of people in front of monuments or beautiful vistas, but now I have no idea what to think. Thoughts? |
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01/17/2005 01:40:37 PM · #16 |
I think people mean snapshot = crapshot, and thus use it as a derogatory remark.
I think snapshots can be excellent myself, but mostly, snapshot does mean crapshot :D
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01/17/2005 01:45:14 PM · #17 |
Originally posted by jonpink:
I think people mean snapshot = crapshot, and thus use it as a derogatory remark.
I think snapshots can be excellent myself, but mostly, snapshot does mean crapshot :D |
Agree. I also see snapshots as those that are not thought out and have no artistic/documentary purpose behind them - just a quick snap to say, "I was here."
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01/17/2005 01:47:00 PM · #18 |
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01/17/2005 01:52:08 PM · #19 |
I agree that there are the usual 'crapshots' of children or relatives (I assume) in this challenge...But if you compare this challenge to others, there is a much much higher percentage of really good photos of people in this challenge.
I'm actually enjoying voting on them (about 33% so far)...There are some great 'moments' in there and they're not celebrated enough on this site.
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01/17/2005 01:53:20 PM · #20 |
I am trying to keep in mind that these are what the photographer really considered to be his/her best shot, and whatever processing he/she did to achieve their end result was because that is exactly how they wanted it to be. Just because I may not like it doesn't mean the processing was "carried away" or the photog didn't know when to quit. This challenge is a chance to show some different processing techniques that might not have worked for other challenges. I'm enjoying seeing the different genres and processing used. Agreed, some shots are what might be considered to be subpar, but overall, there are some engaging images posted. I had 80 shots above 6, and the rest were 4-5-6. Nothing below that. Just because I'm not emotionally attached to someone's kid doesn't mean that it's not a good photo. I might not hang it on my wall, but it can still be a fine photo anyway. I am starting to believe that I am the only one on DPC who looks at the images with an open mind anymore. I understand this is a competition, which makes for great fun and an extremely educational experience. It's what drew me to the site to begin with. I love that aspect. But I also think sometimes it's gotten out of hand in the sense that some might be losing sight of why we participate at all. This is fun, this is learning, this is a way to share your talent, heart, and soul with others. I try to keep that in mind when I vote and when I comment. A virtual ribbon isn't worth the negativity that gets displayed at times in the forums (not necessarily this thread, but you guys know what I mean). I guess I'm naive and silly for thinking like this, but then again, I'm a very upbeat, optimistic, and generally happy person. I see the images as "half full" automatically. Am I all alone in this boat? :o)
edit...I had 40 shots in the 8/9/10 range and 40 were 7's...I didn't add them all up! I'm an idiot! LOL
Message edited by author 2005-01-17 19:12:24.
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01/17/2005 01:57:16 PM · #21 |
Originally posted by jimmythefish:
I'd tend to disagree that 'best' is elusive on this site. If you're considering art, then yes, but but as this is a challenge website it should be interpreted as the shot which you think will score the best in the challenge. As someone who submitted a shot of your child (I think) you may have an emotional connection to that shot, but I certainly don't. Biases must be discarded to consider a shot which will have mass appeal. This isn't art, this is competition. |
In one sentence, you say that 'best' is not elusive, then proceed to tell how you interpret 'best' as if your own interpretation is the only one. Others may not share your taste or your interpretation of what 'best' means.
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01/17/2005 01:58:46 PM · #22 |
You're making assumptions here. I never said that just because it's a child it's a bad shot. Quite the contrary. There needs to be something ELSE about the shot that's good. It needs to be a good portrait, or contain something universally appealing. The shots you posted are good, and I have shots of children rated as 9 and 10 in this challenge. Posting a photo because it's your child, without considering other things, is where it's pointless.
Originally posted by riotspyne:
Originally posted by jimmythefish:
I'd tend to disagree that 'best' is elusive on this site. If you're considering art, then yes, but but as this is a challenge website it should be interpreted as the shot which you think will score the best in the challenge. As someone who submitted a shot of your child (I think) you may have an emotional connection to that shot, but I certainly don't. Biases must be discarded to consider a shot which will have mass appeal. This isn't art, this is competition. |
I couldnt disagree with you more. You dont have to have an emotional connection to the individual or child in a photo to enjoy the photo.
For example I have a connection with these shots and dont need to know the child.
There are the snapshot pics of children but I hate it when people vote down on children justbecause it is a child. It is still photography and this is still a photography website.
Sorry for going off toipc stavidson just needed to get that out.... I feel better now. :P
Edit: damn typos |
Message edited by author 2005-01-17 13:59:39.
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01/17/2005 02:01:52 PM · #23 |
Best is not elusive ON THIS SITE. It's very simple...best is something that will score well here, no? If you're entering a judged competition with hundreds of people voting, mass appeal MUST be considered above all. Sure, you can interpret it other ways I suppose, but then why enter a competition?
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
In one sentence, you say that 'best' is not elusive, then proceed to tell how you interpret 'best' as if your own interpretation is the only one. Others may not share your taste or your interpretation of what 'best' means. |
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01/17/2005 02:02:04 PM · #24 |
Categories: I agree with GeneralIE that it would be nice to have broad categories for entries if this is done again. It really is difficult to jump around so much between subjects with nothing but "Best of" to tie them together.
Snapshots: Agreed, derogatory. There are people I know who will see me scoping out a candid at a family event and run up behind me and snap their camera--"Oooo! Got it!" This has two effects: 1. it usually ruins my shot and interrupts the subjects moment 2. when my shot actually comes out well and later we share our photos, the snapshooter wonders why mine is so much better. It's the thought behind the photo that elevates it above the "gotta have a pic of that" mentality. Another story: I remember driving the Skyline Highway where there are plenty of pull-offs for the views. It seemed like every one I stopped at someone would drive up, hop out of their car with camera in hand, hurry to the overlook and click off a shot, then hop back into their car and speed on to the next overlook. "oooo! that's pretty!" click.
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01/17/2005 02:04:56 PM · #25 |
Originally posted by jimmythefish:
You're making assumptions here. I never said that just because it's a child it's a bad shot. Quite the contrary. There needs to be something ELSE about the shot that's good. It needs to be a good portrait, or contain something universally appealing. The shots you posted are good, and I have shots of children rated as 9 and 10 in this challenge. Posting a photo because it's your child, without considering other things, is where it's pointless.
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Im not saying that you necessarily do that (vote down on children) but there are people who definitely do. |
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