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DPChallenge Forums >> The DPL >> Playoff Seeding?
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07/31/2015 09:39:18 AM · #26
Originally posted by MAK:



Awwww surely you don't still hold a grudge after all these years? ;)


Oh, I do and sometimes still cry myself to sleep as I was beaten by a gorilla (that's the subject not the photographer btw).

As for the final matches, it really doesn't matter now does it?
07/31/2015 11:10:08 AM · #27
I heard we all drop our buffs and they rearrange the teams.
07/31/2015 08:51:30 PM · #28
Originally posted by Ecce_Signum:


As for the final matches, it really doesn't matter now does it?


It could make the DPL trash talk thread a bit more entertaining.
07/31/2015 09:37:20 PM · #29
I didn't realize this was still an issue sorry.

Only the winners are in the playoffs at this point. We have no coding in place for wild cards.

Semifinals: North will Face South and East will face West on the next two challenges posted, the Sunday/Monday and the Tuesday/Wednesday coming up starting Aug 3rd.

The winners will play the finals in the two challenges starting Aug 19th.

Message edited by author 2015-07-31 21:39:21.
08/01/2015 07:46:59 AM · #30
Thanks, Bear.
08/02/2015 04:14:22 AM · #31
Originally posted by Ecce_Signum:

Originally posted by MAK:



Awwww surely you don't still hold a grudge after all these years? ;)


Oh, I do and sometimes still cry myself to sleep as I was beaten by a gorilla (that's the subject not the photographer btw).

As for the final matches, it really doesn't matter now does it?


Looks like you will have your chance this week.. (It was a Chimpanzee not a Gorilla)
08/02/2015 05:50:22 AM · #32
Originally posted by MAK:



Looks like you will have your chance this week.. (It was a Chimpanzee not a Gorilla)


Funny how the memory goes when you get older ;)

And nope, am not really bitter, still have good memories of DPC around that time.

Lets hope it's someone from the World League that takes the DPL Title Mak ;)
08/16/2015 12:01:26 PM · #33
So the challenge that ends in twelve hours and the challenge that ends in two days determine the teams for the DPL playoffs. I have just over 50 votes on each (and one comment between them). My team is not in this and my images may not deserve comments, but I'm shocked at the lack of participation all around.
08/16/2015 12:12:49 PM · #34
I think you are correct on all counts.
08/17/2015 09:40:00 AM · #35
There's an awful lot about this round that I could go on and on about, none of it positive, but that would sound like sour grapes even if we manage to win. But screw it, it needs to be said.

First, when you consider that there are 35 participants just from within the participating teams, that's just under 50% of the entries in Golden Hour and MORE than 1/2 the entries in Shopping Carts, assuming everyone entered. Why is that important? One, because when you consider the scoring based on percentage the difference of a single place is worth 1.25 points in Golden Hour and just over 1.5 in Carts, which means one place difference is far more significant than during the regular rounds, meaning we're competing on a different field (and yes, I know that we're all on the same one, but that's making excuses and missing the point). Second, it shows you how pitiful the participation is here any more.

The next thing I look at are total votes. The number of voters barely covers the participants, which I know is a recurring issue here. But what bothers me more is that my teams' entries have consistently fewer votes than others, by at least 5 or 6. How can that be? Yes, I know we can't vote on our own, but neither can any other team, so it should all wash out. I'd also add that over the last day most of us watched our scores drop by .15 to .2 points. Would love to know if that was consistent across the board.

Finally, and most importantly, I didn't think it could happen but the challenge topics for a playoff round were even worse than those for the 5 regular rounds. First a time and weather based challenge that could effectively eliminate a photographer from participation if their work schedule and/or their climate did not cooperate. Fine for a challenge, not for a playoff challenge. Then something as banal as Shopping Carts. Again, yes we all had to shoot them, but as I pointed out above the awfil topics significantly lowered non-DPL participation which impacts scoring.

This sounds like a rant, but I assure you it isn't. I'm simply stating the obvious for the record. All playoff teams had to deal with it and for that reason I haven't said anything up 'til now. But since Penny brought it up, here you go. Absolutely horrible job with the challenge selection, folks. You did all of us who worked hard to make the playoffs a great disservice with these topics.

Message edited by author 2015-08-17 09:41:23.
08/17/2015 10:36:59 AM · #36
Originally posted by backdoorhippie:



Finally, and most importantly, I didn't think it could happen but the challenge topics for a playoff round were even worse than those for the 5 regular rounds. First a time and weather based challenge that could effectively eliminate a photographer from participation if their work schedule and/or their climate did not cooperate.

Then something as banal as Shopping Carts. Again, yes we all had to shoot them, but as I pointed out above the awfil topics significantly lowered non-DPL participation which impacts scoring.



I completely agree with this. It rained here in Singapore pretty much at least 4 out of the 7 days open for shooting (of which I could only shoot for the 4 day long weekend) and of course the fact remains that there's only a 1-2 hour window when you can shoot. Couldn't enter. Not favorable at all.

As for shopping carts, not sure what is happening but there are some ruthless voters out there. The lesser said the better. Previous few votes have downed my score at least by 0.5 points.
08/17/2015 10:42:11 AM · #37
My list of frustrations is not short either - and yes 2 of my teammates were unable to put in the desired time/effort to the first challenge due to weather =(

Originally posted by backdoorhippie:


Finally, and most importantly, I didn't think it could happen but the challenge topics for a playoff round were even worse than those for the 5 regular rounds. First a time and weather based challenge that could effectively eliminate a photographer from participation if their work schedule and/or their climate did not cooperate. Fine for a challenge, not for a playoff challenge. Then something as banal as Shopping Carts. Again, yes we all had to shoot them, but as I pointed out above the awfil topics significantly lowered non-DPL participation which impacts scoring.
08/17/2015 10:43:39 AM · #38
Funny, Romil and i were writing pretty much the same thing - sorry for the repeated thought.
08/17/2015 10:44:08 AM · #39
i would like a recount in Golden hour.
08/17/2015 10:53:47 AM · #40
Originally posted by Mike:

i would like a recount in Golden hour.


Me too, sixth place is way too high for that shot.
08/17/2015 11:09:43 AM · #41
Originally posted by Mike:

i would like a recount in Golden hour.

I agree, what's with the sprawling landscapes beating our gold-lit little ladies. Impossible. ;)
08/17/2015 11:48:05 AM · #42
It's OK for you guys, my Golden light finished in a useless position, thank God for a great team... it's all down to the wire (trolley wire) and I must say that the top images produces by both semi-final play-offs have been beautiful really top drawer Photography, well done to each and everyone.
08/17/2015 02:12:52 PM · #43
As a countering viewpoint on the challenge topics - I think if you look back, site council did a good job in a position where no matter what they did, people were going to get upset. There was usually a general option like RoT/pastel/crooked and a more specific one like feather/graveyard/liquid etc... to balance out the playing field. Everyone obviously has their photographic comfort zone/wheel house, and so the topics are inevitably going to impact everyone unevenly, but uneven doesn't always mean unfair.

As far as Golden Hour is concerned, I know some are luckier than others with weather but we all had 14 opportunities to get a shot in for what I thought was a very standard and 'page 1 of the photography textbook' type of challenge. If you were caught in a week long monsoon, I see others simulated Golden Hour effects through flash gels and creative processing so I sorta think where there is a will there is a way. And if that didn't work, your creative skills were put to the test with shopping carts, which I completely disagree was a horrible topic. Difficult, sure, but its like on Iron Chef where the mystery ingredient is sea urchin and everyone has to make the best of it.

In any case, I'm not sure what challenge topics would ever be completely fair. The vaguer you get, the more the challenge just becomes a free study and then whoever lives in Iceland or whatever we collectively view as the nicest eye candy has a leg up. I personally live in a somewhat gross city (sorry Philadelphia!), don't have model friends or cute little children, don't have macro equipment, etc..., but have had a really fun time going out and doing new things trying to make something work each week.
08/17/2015 02:16:24 PM · #44
For the record (again) Site Council members have no control over which challenge topics get posted.
08/17/2015 02:19:33 PM · #45
Originally posted by GeneralE:

For the record (again) Site Council members have no control over which challenge topics get posted.


Oh Sorry, well wherever they come from then!
08/17/2015 02:56:49 PM · #46
Originally posted by GeneralE:

For the record (again) Site Council members have no control over which challenge topics get posted.


And for the record, I know this.

Originally posted by AP:

As far as Golden Hour is concerned, I know some are luckier than others with weather but we all had 14 opportunities to get a shot in for what I thought was a very standard and 'page 1 of the photography textbook' type of challenge. If you were caught in a week long monsoon, I see others simulated Golden Hour effects through flash gels and creative processing so I sorta think where there is a will there is a way. And if that didn't work, your creative skills were put to the test with shopping carts, which I completely disagree was a horrible topic. Difficult, sure, but its like on Iron Chef where the mystery ingredient is sea urchin and everyone has to make the best of it.


I'm sorry, but I couldn't disagree with you more here. We all did not have 14 opportunities to get a shot. Whether it has to do with weather opportunity or life circumstances I would say that many didn't have half those opportunities, and when they did half those times didn't get cooperation. I had 3 of 14 where the light was such that it made shots for the challenge possible and wound up going with one from a day I'd planned specifically for it but the sun never cooperated until the last possible moment. The others? Weak days at best. Fake it? Sure. But again my complaint is that this sort of "creativity" in the face of a potential dearth of real opportunities should never have been presented in a DPL challenge. Sure, it's basic photography, but the one thing you'll hear every photographer say about the golden hour is that it's best and most elusive light you can find, and some spend weeks or months chasing it. Not unfair, but certainly unreasonable given what's on the line. And to back it with something as pedestrian as shopping carts... I've already said what I had to say about that.

You want the challenges to be challenging in the playoffs, for sure, so use something that levels the playing field and let the cream rise. To your example, Iron Chef does just that - everybody gets the same Sea Urchin and the same pantry. This came with a randomly imposed handicap that would be more akin to a souffle challenge where some get eggs and butter and some get a carton of egg beaters and a can of Crisco. Win or lose this souffle's left a bad taste in my mouth for over a week now.
08/17/2015 03:16:27 PM · #47
i didn't shoot mine during the traditional golden hour.

Message edited by author 2015-08-17 15:18:09.
08/17/2015 03:34:47 PM · #48
Jake, I hear what your saying (I had one Golden Hour opportunity) however, please give me us all 2 challenge topics that would present a completely level playing field for all members of the final 4 teams. And, if possible the links to the suggested challenge thread.

08/17/2015 03:56:35 PM · #49
Originally posted by Ecce_Signum:

Jake, I hear what your saying (I had one Golden Hour opportunity) however, please give me us all 2 challenge topics that would present a completely level playing field for all members of the final 4 teams. And, if possible the links to the suggested challenge thread.


Look, I realize that no challenge will be "completely level" because of differing skill levels, either shooting or in post, but there are certainly challenges that are less opportunity dependent. You want examples? I don't even have to leave the front page of the forum to point to Snapshot and Morning as perfectly reasonable alternatives that pose no artificial boundaries to entry.
08/17/2015 03:58:46 PM · #50
Originally posted by Mike:

i didn't shoot mine during the traditional golden hour.


And I believe your entry should be summarily disqualified for it!! Can I see a show of hands? Who's with me?! ;)
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