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DPChallenge Forums >> Tips, Tricks, and Q&A >> Black Backgrounds
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07/28/2002 01:39:38 AM · #1
I know I've been asking a lot of questions, but I get such great feedback here..It's great!! THANKS

I'm wondering how to get those deep dark backgrounds, ie.. sample 1 sample 2
Do they come out that way in the camera, or is it more of an after-shot adjustment - like gamma?

yeah, yeah, I know WE are all addicted - right?
07/28/2002 02:00:29 AM · #2
Hi RedRuthann, I'm curious as to the variety answers you will get with this post. I'm certain there are a plethora of ways to achieve dark backgrounds. - My best successes have been with using a simple flash at a lower light setting on the subject. Make sure the subject is far enough away from anything that might catch the light. A black backdrop will help if solid black it what you are after.
07/28/2002 02:11:27 AM · #3
Originally posted by RedRuthann:
I know I''ve been asking a lot of questions, but I get such great feedback here..It''s great!! THANKS

I''m wondering how to get those deep dark backgrounds, ie.. sample 1 sample 2
Do they come out that way in the camera, or is it more of an after-shot adjustment - like gamma?

yeah, yeah, I know WE are all addicted - right?



In my "Stunning In Any Color" I wrapped a black cloth around the stems and surrounding area - I also softened my flash and unsharp masked the heck out of it.


* This message has been edited by the author on 7/28/2002 2:11:38 AM.


* This message has been edited by the author on 7/28/2002 2:12:57 AM.
07/28/2002 02:11:33 AM · #4
Part of it is the calibration of your monitor, since the first sample has a medium navy blue background on my monitor. ;-)

If you look under my profile, one of my photos is "My Other Digital Camera". For that photo, I shot at night and used one 60-watt light bulb in a clip light and a mirror to reflect light back. The subject was on a black surface about two or three feet from the wall behind it, where I put a black matboard. For that shot, I didn't do anything to the photo other than resize it.

There are things you can adjust, such as contrast and brightness, but it can be difficult to deepen the blacks without blowing out the highlights, since we can't spot edit. I find it's easier for challenges to use the minimum amount of light necessary, tightly focus the light I do use, and use a background as dark and non-reflective as possible.
07/28/2002 02:23:46 AM · #5
It appears that another way to get perfect darkness behind a subject is to erase the background as was done in sample 2. I just did a close up looking for signs of support. Found what I thought was a glass shelf untill I looked at the heal area. Stairsteps. aelith
07/28/2002 02:44:44 PM · #6
Amphian - I'm having more trouble with monitors lately,it's unbelievable. Thanks now I see the blue. My Dell laptop screen needs to be repaired (but can't stand the thought of not having a computer for a week :-( ) and the second monitor is a compaq presario. At least now I had something to judge it against...so thanks!

Thanks everyone for your help. I think I'm skipping this week's Corp Wrld - no enthusiasm for me - instead try out some new stuff.

Ruthann
07/28/2002 02:54:44 PM · #7
Originally posted by aelith:
It appears that another way to get perfect darkness behind a subject is to erase the background as was done in sample 2. I just did a close up looking for signs of support. Found what I thought was a glass shelf untill I looked at the heal area. Stairsteps. aelith

You're right. If you equalize in Photoshop you can see it. Do people not read the rules, or just not care?


07/28/2002 02:58:46 PM · #8
Originally posted by RedRuthann:
Amphian - I'm having more trouble with monitors lately,it's unbelievable. Thanks now I see the blue. My Dell laptop screen needs to be repaired (but can't stand the thought of not having a computer for a week :-( ) and the second monitor is a compaq presario. At least now I had something to judge it against...so thanks!


If you're running Windows, that is part of the reason why things look darker. It has to do with the gamma settings used in Windows. This link has a nice explanation.



07/28/2002 03:15:02 PM · #9
Originally posted by Amphian:
You're right. If you equalize in Photoshop you can see it. Do people not read the rules, or just not care?


Clay just doesn't care. He's been suspended from this site numerous times for rules violations and for being disruptive.

-Terry
07/28/2002 03:25:57 PM · #10
Directional lighting can also improve the darkenss of your background as in THIS EXAMPLE.

To get this background dark naturally without having to use software after the fact, I raised my leaf up off the floor by setting it on top of a drinking glass (hidden by the leaf in the photo). I placed my light source above the subject slightly and did not allow the light to hit the floor directly underneath the leaf. I put a black shirt underneath the drinking glass as well... Since the light source was not hitting the floor underneath, the background is almost perfectly black without any post processing...
07/28/2002 03:39:57 PM · #11
These are all shot on black velvet background. I've also used velour (it's a lot less expensive).


Straight outta the camera, pretty much:

Black Background Examples
07/28/2002 04:08:30 PM · #12
Where did you buy black velvet or velour and how much does it cost?

Originally posted by magnetic9999:
These are all shot on black velvet background. I've also used velour (it's a lot less expensive).


Straight outta the camera, pretty much:

Black Background Examples


07/28/2002 04:12:22 PM · #13
Black velour or velvet can be purchased at any fabric store such as Bouclair and Fabricland.. not sure what the non-canadian stores are tho :P Expect it to run you between 10 and 20 bucks a metre canadian depends where u go and if it's on sale. There are also other fuzzier black fabrics that will work just as well and might be a bit cheaper to buy. Just try and get something that wont get staticky easily.. otherwise you might be forever picking lint and hairs off your backdrop
07/28/2002 04:25:23 PM · #14
Thanks I'll try the fabric store for black velour, I already tried for black velvet but they didn't have any.
07/28/2002 05:02:52 PM · #15
there are high end fabric stores that carry the velvet but it's pricey - i think around 15$ a yard and up.

also a lint brush comes in really handy for when you're working with the stuff.
08/01/2002 03:18:17 AM · #16
for the shoe, i used a dark t-shirt pinned against the wall and my vcr. many of you noticed, and pointed out to me, that it was a little pixilated. this happened because i had to adjust the colors, because i didnt use the flash. the original picture is HERE. if you were to adjust the colors and levels in the same fashion as i did, you should get a similar result.

if you equalize WANING STRIVE it has the same aliasing effect as the shoe. so i guess ive just been doing this for quite a while.

if you mess with the levels enough, you will get a clear background. i could have gone all the way with THIS BOTTLE but i didnt want to lose the reflection. if you equalize this it almost has the same aliasing as the other two. but its slightly less since i didnt adjust the levels to the fullest. this picture was taken in the same place as the shoe. had i kept going with the adjustments, it would have a completely blank background.


edited to fix the links

* This message has been edited by the author on 8/1/2002 3:20:00 AM.
08/01/2002 04:31:36 AM · #17
Originally posted by clay:
for the shoe, i used a dark t-shirt pinned against the wall and my vcr. many of you noticed, and pointed out to me, that it was a little pixilated. this happened because i had to adjust the colors, because i didnt use the flash. the original picture is HERE. if you were to adjust the colors and levels in the same fashion as i did, you should get a similar result.

OK, I give up. I've been playing with this for half an hour, and I cannot get rid of the light on the VCR or the blue bits in the background using levels. I would love to know how to do this.

BTW, I love the perfume bottle, but I'd like it even more if you'd gotten more of the wrinkled background to make wisps like the one in the lower right.
08/01/2002 06:53:52 AM · #18
i dont remember exactly what i did, but it went along the lines of:

use ps7 to auto color.
possibly auto contrast or the other auto something - i dont have ps at work so i cant see what the other is.
adjust the contrast and brightness.
save it, open it with paint shop pro.
adjust hue, saturation, highlights/midtone/shadow.
adjust the hue map.
save it, open it with ps7.
adjust contrast and brightness again.
adjust levels.

thats basically what i do to all of my pictures to see if i can make them look different. i dont have any manual, or abnormal settings on my camera so i try to make up for it with software
08/01/2002 09:38:56 AM · #19
I use cardboard which you can buy in stationary shops or shops selling stuff for handicrafts. It's a bit bigger than A3 and you can buy it in different colors. It#s also relatively cheap (don't remember the price but is was below 5 Euros). Because it's a plain surface it does not reflect the light unevenly like T-Shirs or other cloths may do.
08/01/2002 12:01:38 PM · #20
Originally posted by stephan:
[i]I use cardboard which you can buy in stationary shops or shops selling stuff for handicrafts. It's a bit bigger than A3 and you can buy it in different colors. It#s also relatively cheap (don't remember the price but is was below 5 Euros). i]

Mr. Stephan, 5 Euros is how many yuan, jiao and fen, and what is a A3? :)
08/01/2002 12:06:51 PM · #21
Just another example of "seamless black background". I used black felt (ironed to remove the wrinkles and fold lines). Levels in PS7 were used to adjust the darkness of the background, but not so much as to eliminate the pattern in the forground.

08/01/2002 12:09:19 PM · #22
The A3 simply refers to certain size of paper.

All he is saying its to use a black piece of paper to get the dark background. As for cost, I''m sure if you look around you probably already have one.

* This message has been edited by the author on 8/1/2002 12:09:10 PM.
08/01/2002 12:18:46 PM · #23
Originally posted by Mieka:
Originally posted by stephan:
I use cardboard which you can buy in stationary shops or shops selling stuff for handicrafts. It''s a bit bigger than A3 and you can buy it in different colors. It#s also relatively cheap (don''t remember the price but is was below 5 Euros).

Mr. Stephan, 5 Euros is how many yuan, jiao and fen, and what is a A3? :)


Mieka,

I think I know what you have in mind without giving away your intentions in my opinion I think it is a good idea. Black felt I used was from the local craft store and cost $6 for a six foot square.





* This message has been edited by the author on 8/1/2002 12:22:11 PM.
08/01/2002 12:30:31 PM · #24
Originally posted by daysez:
Originally posted by Mieka:
Originally posted by stephan:
[i]I use cardboard which you can buy in stationary shops or shops selling stuff for handicrafts. It''s a bit bigger than A3 and you can buy it in different colors. It#s also relatively cheap (don''t remember the price but is was below 5 Euros).

Mr. Stephan, 5 Euros is how many yuan, jiao and fen, and what is a A3? :)


Mieka,

I think I know what you have in mind without giving away your intentions in my opinion I think it is a good idea. Black felt I used was from the local craft store and cost $6 for a six foot square.


[/i]

China is currently converting to the Euros - this was jus a poor attempt to poke mean fun at the situation. But a A3, I have no idea. I thought it was envelope.
08/01/2002 09:14:46 PM · #25
Hiho Mieka!

Originally posted by Mieka:
China is currently converting to the Euros - this was jus a poor attempt to poke mean fun at the situation.

Converting? Really? Can''t believe it! But that would be cool :-) At the moment 5 Euro is about 40 Yuan, 7 Jiao and 9 Fen.

But a A3, I have no idea. I thought it was envelope.

Oops. I didn''t realize that this is not common in the US. Damn Euro-centric Europeans, always think that everything abroad does not matter and everybody should follow our rules ;-).

It''s a (german only?) norm for paper sizes. A3 is twice the size of A4 which in turn is twice the size of A5. Easy, isn''t it?

Actually I made a mistake and my paper is A2 (420 x 594 millimeters), so four times the size of A4 which is 210 x 297 millimeters (the size of a normal page of a college block or something like that).

Now don''t ask what millimeters are... *grin*



* This message has been edited by the author on 8/1/2002 9:21:12 PM.
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