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09/20/2011 05:00:30 PM · #76
Originally posted by pederlol:


And concerning the scores: I voted on all the "wine" photos - and I completely stick with my 3.49 average votes: most photos are poorly lit, composed and lack ideas and imagination. Since when is a paying member not allowed to vote without commenting? What a way to welcome a new member :/


Of course you are allowed to do whatever you like, but as you feel that the majority of images submitted fall below the median, sharing your opinion on which flaws apply to which images would be helpful to other members. A blandly positive comment is rarely helpful, a specific negative comment often is.
09/20/2011 05:35:51 PM · #77
Originally posted by BrennanOB:

Originally posted by pederlol:


And concerning the scores: I voted on all the "wine" photos - and I completely stick with my 3.49 average votes: most photos are poorly lit, composed and lack ideas and imagination. Since when is a paying member not allowed to vote without commenting? What a way to welcome a new member :/


Of course you are allowed to do whatever you like, but as you feel that the majority of images submitted fall below the median, sharing your opinion on which flaws apply to which images would be helpful to other members. A blandly positive comment is rarely helpful, a specific negative comment often is.


As long as the negative comment is given in a constructive way, without sneering or scoff at the maker.
09/20/2011 07:03:24 PM · #78
First he said:
Originally posted by pederlol:

I guess I was a bit harsh on the votes at first... went through them all again.
Originally posted by pederlol:



I don't understand how his voting style would change; Because people called him out on it? but then:

And concerning the scores: I voted on all the "wine" photos - and I completely stick with my 3.49 average votes: most photos are poorly lit, composed and lack ideas and imagination. Since when is a paying member not allowed to vote without commenting? What a way to welcome a new member :/


I don't get it. He "went through them all again" (since august 9th, mind you), but he sticks to his 3.49 average. So is he saying he is still harsh?

Curious to see which wine shot is his, It will blow our minds with it's perfect lighting, composition and ideas/imagination.

pederlol Please review mine afterwards and PM me, I want to know if mine is "poorly lit, composed and lack ideas and imagination" and how I can improve it.
thanks
09/20/2011 07:35:05 PM · #79
I find it interesting when people join this site, find their own work far superior to everyone else here, vote accordingly and then choose not to "participate" with regard to leaving constructive comments or offering any type of suggestions. Do they join this learning sight to stroke their own egos as apparently we don't have anything to teach them here with our low quality photography.

Dropped again.
Votes: 61
Views: 121
Avg Vote: 5.4754
Comments: 0
09/20/2011 08:36:42 PM · #80
Welcome pederlol, and I hope you'll participate in many more challenges and will vote and comment more.

It took me quite a while after I joined before I started giving back to the DPC community by voting/commenting more. And ofcourse, everyone sees/votes differently here. I myself prefer a low voter who participates in the challenges to one who doesn't.

As for this challenge, I've just started going through it - some nice images in there. I'll keep commenting as much as I can.

You have rated 16 of 127 images (13%) in this challenge.
You have commented on 16 images (13%) in this challenge.
You have given an average score of 6.8750
09/20/2011 09:22:28 PM · #81
I found quite a few excellent images in this challenge.

Stats: You have rated 127 of 127 images (100%) in this challenge.
You have commented on 32 images (25%) in this challenge.
You have given an average score of 6.3780.
09/20/2011 11:52:07 PM · #82
Originally posted by pederlol:

Originally posted by adigitalromance:

Originally posted by bhuge:

Will pederlol's pic have the same Author in it's EXIF, I guess we will find out after voting.


It does list the same creator. So does that mean "they" are sharing a camera?


It does indeed not. And from the EXIF data you will see that we do not share camera. Why on earth would I shoot with a 550d, compared to a 5d mII?

And concerning the scores: I voted on all the "wine" photos - and I completely stick with my 3.49 average votes: most photos are poorly lit, composed and lack ideas and imagination. Since when is a paying member not allowed to vote without commenting? What a way to welcome a new member :/

I didn't want to come off as an idiot, but somehow you guys made me...

edit: And on topic:

Votes: 62
Views: 122
Avg Vote: 5.4839

Oh and btw: 0 comments on my submission so far.....


I guess I just don't get it. It says in your profile that you shoot with the 550d Canon Rebel and in blacknoir's profile it says he shoots with the 5D MII....I agree the 5D MII is a much better camera that the 550d Canon Rebel. Did you mean that you shoot with the 5D MII and he shoots with the Canon 550d Rebel? You need to switch that in you and your friends profile.

I do want to welcome you here,....I hope you can find some inspiration at some point here. It really can be a very nice place.
09/21/2011 12:51:35 AM · #83
To help clear things up, may i suggest that Pederlol and Blacknoir both submit on the You+1 challenge. It would be great if we can see the two of you in one photo :)

You're not Batman and Bruce Wayne, right?

Just a suggestion...
09/21/2011 01:23:35 AM · #84
Originally posted by bergiekat:

I find it interesting when people join this site, find their own work far superior to everyone else here, vote accordingly and then choose not to "participate" with regard to leaving constructive comments or offering any type of suggestions. Do they join this learning sight to stroke their own egos as apparently we don't have anything to teach them here with our low quality photography.

Dropped again.
Votes: 61
Views: 121
Avg Vote: 5.4754
Comments: 0


The higher one flies, the lower and harder one falls.
All eyes are set on him (and his 2 friends) now

Climbed a bit over night

Votes: 67
Views: 129
Avg Vote: 5.4627
Comments: 0
09/21/2011 03:06:23 AM · #85
Originally posted by njsabs:



I guess I just don't get it. It says in your profile that you shoot with the 550d Canon Rebel and in blacknoir's profile it says he shoots with the 5D MII....I agree the 5D MII is a much better camera that the 550d Canon Rebel. Did you mean that you shoot with the 5D MII and he shoots with the Canon 550d Rebel? You need to switch that in you and your friends profile.

I do want to welcome you here,....I hope you can find some inspiration at some point here. It really can be a very nice place.


My profile is made with the exact gear that I own and use. Never changed. My profile picture is taken by Blacknoir, by him, with his gear (5d MII). I can't see where the confusion began. And thanks a lot! - I'll try not to be too scared of entering other challenges.

Originally posted by Cyberlandz:

To help clear things up, may i suggest that Pederlol and Blacknoir both submit on the You+1 challenge. It would be great if we can see the two of you in one photo :)

You're not Batman and Bruce Wayne, right?

Just a suggestion...


He'll probably be in some of my future submissions :)

Originally posted by Nadine_Vb:

The higher one flies, the lower and harder one falls.
All eyes are set on him (and his 2 friends) now


I wasn't the one seeking the spotlight - it was pointed because of false accusations.

Originally posted by Chandi:

Welcome pederlol, and I hope you'll participate in many more challenges and will vote and comment more.

It took me quite a while after I joined before I started giving back to the DPC community by voting/commenting more. And ofcourse, everyone sees/votes differently here. I myself prefer a low voter who participates in the challenges to one who doesn't.


Thank you! I'll surely comment more (eg. begin to comment in the first place) in the future!

Originally posted by bergiekat:

I find it interesting when people join this site, find their own work far superior to everyone else here, vote accordingly and then choose not to "participate" with regard to leaving constructive comments or offering any type of suggestions. Do they join this learning sight to stroke their own egos as apparently we don't have anything to teach them here with our low quality photography.


Please don't jump to false conclusions. I joined this site because I heard it was very inspirational and I'd really like some constructive critisism on my very amature'ish photographs.

Originally posted by adigitalromance:

It's probably me that's coming across as an idiot. I don't mean to jump to any conclusions. Sorry for that.


No problem! And thanks for the PM :)

Anyways, I think I'll lay low for a while, prepare, and brace myself for when you all see my horrific submissions :)

edit: grammar

Message edited by author 2011-09-21 03:08:07.
09/21/2011 11:34:59 AM · #86
Sigh! Was climbing up nicely, then got nailed with a 3! This shot technically is nowhere near a 3, so I guess the voter doesn't like wine! :P No comment, so the guessing continues....lol!

Pederlol, my previous comment was not specifically directed at you, but you can take it however you like. We DO welcome you here, but the questions arise when you call yourself amateurish, yet you vote on everyone elses submissions as if we are all clueless at photography. Your voting record is what has many questioning you and your thoughts of our submissions! Should you score mid 5's in this challenge...what would make your score so much more superior that you would only vote with an average of 3.1678!!!! That's NOT a good average for the rest of us, but that is what is telling of your thoughts on our works.

Now, back to your regularly scheduled programming.
09/21/2011 12:54:54 PM · #87
You know, when I first started voting here, my average was a 3 something for the first few challenges. Another member commented on it, we discussed in private, we reviewed photos together..in the end I probably judged too harshly due to my own lack of knowledge in photography, and he actually decided that maybe he could stand to be a little more critical.

Just a different perspective to throw in here, because I'm watching this new member get trashed, and I'm looking at him thinking "that was me!" And I can tell you in all honesty, when I first started voting, it was absolutely not my intention to put down the work of other photographers, and I did not think my own work was superior. My eye just wasn't sharp enough, plain and simple.

Maybe that's the case here?
09/21/2011 12:57:43 PM · #88
I want to backpedal a little bit. I read my original post about all of this and it was much more accusatory than I intended. My main worry was between zarko and blacknoir, which I still think is probably the same person. You had the unfortunate coincidence of having the a profile picture that had me jumping to conclusions.

I do trust that you are not an alter ego of blacknoir and in all honesty wish you the best on this site. What your vote average is is your own business. Sure I wish it was higher, but I also realize that everyone needs to have full control over their own voting style or this site won't work.

For me... holding steady with a "meh" score

Votes: 68
Views: 135
Avg Vote: 5.4706
Comments: 0
09/21/2011 04:44:53 PM · #89
Wow, all of this just came to my attention...
To clear a thing or two, pederlol and me(blacknoir) are friends - no alter ego there;-)By the way I really like the idea of Bruce Wayne and batman;-)

Ok, here it goes - the whole truth.
A while back I got my fourth disqualification i a row, yeah im an idiot;-(
This was right before the noir challenge, which was right up my alley. So i signed up as blacknoir, just for this one challenge.
But my disqualification made it a real pain in the arse to enter challenges, so i stuck with my alter ego blacknoir, leaving my true name zarko behind.
I know you cant have multiple accounts, but i couldn't delete my first one...
It all comes down to this, i really like this sites and its challenges/members/inspiration. So pretty please don't cast me out the gate.

Regarding my voting and commenting:
My average vote is extremely low and my criticism is nonexistent. I would hate to come off as one who nourish my ego and brings nothing to the community - even thought a glance at my profile tells exactly that. While writing this im really ashamed, because non of this was intended. A bully with nothing to give;-(
I just have a system when i vote - bad pictures get 1-3, average pics get 4-7 and really good pics get 7-10. This way i eliminate bad pictures from the good ones, and that way celebrates does who makes an effort. It seem even more harsh and ignorant, when there is no comments to back it up.
All of this has really shed some light on my role on DPC, and hopefully i´ll become a better sport on this marvelous site...

So there you go, the ugly truth about zarko and his alter ego blacknoir.

My destiny lays in the hands of the Site Council and its members

Sorry for bad grammar and english

- So, do you want some whine with that cheese




09/21/2011 04:52:08 PM · #90
Btw some good detective work by bhuge!
09/21/2011 04:58:08 PM · #91
Originally posted by kichu:

You know, when I first started voting here, my average was a 3 something for the first few challenges. Another member commented on it, we discussed in private, we reviewed photos together..in the end I probably judged too harshly due to my own lack of knowledge in photography, and he actually decided that maybe he could stand to be a little more critical.

Just a different perspective to throw in here, because I'm watching this new member get trashed, and I'm looking at him thinking "that was me!" And I can tell you in all honesty, when I first started voting, it was absolutely not my intention to put down the work of other photographers, and I did not think my own work was superior. My eye just wasn't sharp enough, plain and simple.

Maybe that's the case here?


I have to admit I was kinda the same. My voting style was "If I believe I can take the same picture, better, you got a sub 4. I know it is wrong now, I learned once I entered a couple challenges and realized I was too harsh compared to others...
09/21/2011 05:05:26 PM · #92
Whatta thread, I think we need a group hug! :p
09/21/2011 05:14:12 PM · #93
My wine score has not been hit by a 1 yet. Has it been effective already? ;)
PS Or maybe I did not notice. I have been doing quite a bit of wine tasting lately . ^ , ... ~~ etc et
09/21/2011 05:20:29 PM · #94
Originally posted by blacknoir:

This way i eliminate bad pictures from the good ones, and that way celebrates does who makes an effort.


This touches a nerve, and is not aimed at you specifically but more generally towards a blind spot in assessing images.

It irks me is when people believe they are capable of knowing how much effort went into a shot, and use that belief to guide their scoring. There is nothing like getting a dismissive vote or comment because the voter sees an image as a snapshot with no planning or effort.

If you don't like it, fine. Neither did I. However a great deal of thought and effort went into this shot. Much more in all probability than some of those on the front page who happened to be out doing something else and got a lucky image.

My all time most grating comment recieved was "it seems that this is just a quick snapshot, with no prior conception of what the end photograph would look like". This on an image that whatever it's faults was planned for days, and lit different ways over and over untill I got exactly what I wanted. Feel free to think the end result is an abomination, but don't presume to know what went into an image, judge the work as it is presented. Any assumptions about how much effort the image took to make, are your own.
09/21/2011 05:55:14 PM · #95
Originally posted by blacknoir:

Btw some good detective work by bhuge!


I actually started the detective work because I was a fan of your entries :)

I saw the profile pic for pederlol and noticed that it was an outtake of your entry. If someone found an outtake then I knew there had to be more examples of your work out there somewhere for me to admire. My friend Google brought me to your flickr page. That's when I noticed old entries from zarko and got suspicious.

As long as the zarko account is dead and your not voting from both, then I could care less if you have both. I'm sure the SC could close one of them for you and avoid any need to "cast you out the gate". Which also lets me admire your work some more :)
09/21/2011 06:08:48 PM · #96
Originally posted by blacknoir:

...snip...

Regarding my voting and commenting:
My average vote is extremely low and my criticism is nonexistent. I would hate to come off as one who nourish my ego and brings nothing to the community - even thought a glance at my profile tells exactly that. While writing this im really ashamed, because non of this was intended. A bully with nothing to give;-(
I just have a system when i vote - bad pictures get 1-3, average pics get 4-7 and really good pics get 7-10. This way i eliminate bad pictures from the good ones, and that way celebrates does who makes an effort. It seem even more harsh and ignorant, when there is no comments to back it up. ...snip...


Based on your voting...almost all shots here are bad! (I added the bolding.)
09/21/2011 06:10:18 PM · #97
Originally posted by BrennanOB:

Originally posted by blacknoir:

This way i eliminate bad pictures from the good ones, and that way celebrates does who makes an effort.


This touches a nerve, and is not aimed at you specifically but more generally towards a blind spot in assessing images.

It irks me is when people believe they are capable of knowing how much effort went into a shot, and use that belief to guide their scoring. There is nothing like getting a dismissive vote or comment because the voter sees an image as a snapshot with no planning or effort.

If you don't like it, fine. Neither did I. However a great deal of thought and effort went into this shot. Much more in all probability than some of those on the front page who happened to be out doing something else and got a lucky image.

My all time most grating comment recieved was "it seems that this is just a quick snapshot, with no prior conception of what the end photograph would look like". This on an image that whatever it's faults was planned for days, and lit different ways over and over untill I got exactly what I wanted. Feel free to think the end result is an abomination, but don't presume to know what went into an image, judge the work as it is presented. Any assumptions about how much effort the image took to make, are your own.


I know that shot! Some weirdo took it...
09/21/2011 06:14:27 PM · #98
Originally posted by blacknoir:

Wow, all of this just came to my attention...
To clear a thing or two, pederlol and me(blacknoir) are friends - no alter ego there;-)By the way I really like the idea of Bruce Wayne and batman;-)

Ok, here it goes - the whole truth.
A while back I got my fourth disqualification i a row, yeah im an idiot;-(
This was right before the noir challenge, which was right up my alley. So i signed up as blacknoir, just for this one challenge.
But my disqualification made it a real pain in the arse to enter challenges, so i stuck with my alter ego blacknoir, leaving my true name zarko behind.
I know you cant have multiple accounts, but i couldn't delete my first one...
It all comes down to this, i really like this sites and its challenges/members/inspiration. So pretty please don't cast me out the gate.

Regarding my voting and commenting:
My average vote is extremely low and my criticism is nonexistent. I would hate to come off as one who nourish my ego and brings nothing to the community - even thought a glance at my profile tells exactly that. While writing this im really ashamed, because non of this was intended. A bully with nothing to give;-(
I just have a system when i vote - bad pictures get 1-3, average pics get 4-7 and really good pics get 7-10. This way i eliminate bad pictures from the good ones, and that way celebrates does who makes an effort. It seem even more harsh and ignorant, when there is no comments to back it up.
All of this has really shed some light on my role on DPC, and hopefully i´ll become a better sport on this marvelous site...

So there you go, the ugly truth about zarko and his alter ego blacknoir.

My destiny lays in the hands of the Site Council and its members

Sorry for bad grammar and english

- So, do you want some whine with that cheese


From Rules:
1st DQ in last 25 submissions: No penalty
2nd DQ in last 25 submissions: 1 week suspension of submission privileges
3rd DQ in last 25 submissions: 2 week suspension of submission privileges
4th DQ in last 25 submissions: 4 week suspension of submission privileges and 3 months of required “pre-submission” of proof file.


I guess you, "Zarko", didn't want to be suspended for 4 weeks. I wouldn't either, but... :-)
09/21/2011 06:21:26 PM · #99
Haha, Mike! You're such a goober!
I know the artist of that shot and he's no weirdo...overachiever maybe, but no weirdo! :P
09/22/2011 01:31:27 AM · #100
Originally posted by bergiekat:

Originally posted by blacknoir:

...snip...

Regarding my voting and commenting:
My average vote is extremely low and my criticism is nonexistent. I would hate to come off as one who nourish my ego and brings nothing to the community - even thought a glance at my profile tells exactly that. While writing this im really ashamed, because non of this was intended. A bully with nothing to give;-(
I just have a system when i vote - bad pictures get 1-3, average pics get 4-7 and really good pics get 7-10. This way i eliminate bad pictures from the good ones, and that way celebrates does who makes an effort. It seem even more harsh and ignorant, when there is no comments to back it up. ...snip...


Based on your voting...almost all shots here are bad! (I added the bolding.)

I think there's one thing both gentlemen should realize: this community has beginners in potography and more advanced ones, there are people who can spend a fortune sort of speaking to create a shot while others have to manage with basic. Some people have to use desklamps, construction lamps to realize their picture, others have a real studio to use with models and all.
Everyone shoots following their ability. So, saying that there are bad pics and really good pics... sorry. There are no bad pics imho. There are less good pics. A picture that deserves e.g. a 1 or a 2 is a picture even my grandma or mother would do better.
Once in a while there are pictures like that passing the review. But selden. In the wine challenge, I don't see even 1 picture deserving a 1 or even a 2.

Someone has to be the best photographer on a site, someone has to be the worst.
But I'm the biggest fan of the best photographer which remains simple and modest and which shares his knowledge with the less good ones, who supports lesser photographers and helps building them up in stead of tearing them down.

Message edited by author 2011-09-22 01:34:19.
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