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03/12/2009 09:36:11 PM · #1 |
Yeah, this page really explains it: make less than "got fries with that?"
One of their "ultra" stores is in huge contrast to the regular ones. I found competent people in the former, but yeah, they're always trying to sell you something extra.
ETA: Since 2003, I've buy my bodies and most of my lenses from Bel Air Camera in Westwood. I walk in having done my homework, and appreciate a place to "kick the tires". They will negotiate, which helps. And I walk in there perhaps 4 times a year, am recognized and treated well, even if just buying occasionally. Accessories, yeah, largely over the 'net unless pressed for time.
Message edited by author 2009-03-12 21:38:26. |
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03/12/2009 09:21:57 PM · #2 |
Apparently it goes a lot deeper than that. A friend of mine works at Ritz and apparently a lot of their staff are really ticked off about how they're treated. He gave me this website
//whyritzisfailing.bravehost.com
and said the corporate office is trying to take it down. Crazy stuff. |
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03/01/2009 07:40:10 PM · #3 |
| Ritz was always the last place i'd look for anything. Most items were expensive at Ritz when I checked. |
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03/01/2009 07:21:12 PM · #4 |
| i THINK I saw somewhere that the website and stores are different but might be mistaken. |
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03/01/2009 06:15:57 PM · #5 |
Oh, snap! I was going to order a strobe kit from them. Damn! Their site still looks pretty open for business, though.
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03/01/2009 05:30:36 PM · #6 |
| Never been impressed with Ritz - too pricey, crap customer service, no "feel-good glow" for buying local. I've been trying to frequent my local shop as much as possible - the great Central Camera (www.centralcamera.com), but still find I get most of my major gear from BH and KEH. |
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03/01/2009 03:53:25 AM · #7 |
Originally posted by HelenOster:
Originally posted by Azrifel:
.......if say Adorama is next... And a couple of small ones.... |
Ian't one of the BIG differences, that Adorama works hard to excell in customer service, alongside offering competitive pricing?
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I am hypothetically considering the influence of more down the pipeline problems for Canon and Nikon USA. Hence the "if say...". And that is purely an economic point of view.
You can have fantastic customer service and competitive pricing. But that tells zero about the company's ability to pay all its bills / maintain a proper cash flow.
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03/01/2009 02:48:36 AM · #8 |
Originally posted by Azrifel:
.......if say Adorama is next... And a couple of small ones.... |
Isn't one of the BIG differences, that Adorama works hard to excell in customer service, alongside offering competitive pricing?
Sincerely
Helen Oster
Adorama Camera Customer Service Ambassador
helen.oster@adoramacamera.com
//www.adoramacamera.com
Message edited by author 2009-03-02 07:11:11. |
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02/25/2009 12:36:02 AM · #9 |
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
Just out of curiosity, how many of y'all went to a local store to touch test equipment, then bought online?
How many of you have used the small, knowledgeable pro shops?
Like I said, I have used them, but I find it difficult as that's where I get the high-handed attitude.....which makes no sense as far as customer retention goes.
I won't alienate the one that has been reasonably decent to me, but they just don't seem to be eager for my business, either. |
I touch tested my D300 "locally" at Best Buy, along with the Canon 40D, but bought through Adorama (whom I purchased my S9100 through blind because nobody here had it). I'll touch test and try on outdoor gear at REI, and I'm even a member, but I often order through a local shop I like, or will buy from Moosejaw, a smaller chain based in Michigan that has a great customer service/price compromise. If the price difference is around 10% or less, I'll always go local if there is a supplier that I like. Same thing with coffee shops I regular (and I really do regular them...ha). In general I try to go local for anything. Hell, I even buy the whole bean coffee I grind for at home from a Denver based roaster that is sold through a Colorado based grocery store. It just happens that photography suppliers are few and far between, and driving to Denver just to check something out isn't really worth my while.
ETA quotes
Message edited by author 2009-02-25 00:42:14. |
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02/24/2009 06:11:25 PM · #10 |
Whew, I've never been so thankful to live in L.A. Got the gigantic Samy's camera as well as Calumet and some smaller shops here, all brimming with knowledgeable, helpful people and huge stocks. I went to a Ritz once, and was quite underwhelmed. Felt cheap, cold, uncaring...
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02/24/2009 05:59:01 PM · #11 |
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Originally posted by pamelasue:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Originally posted by FireBird:
Originally posted by OdysseyF22:
I dunno, I guess I won't care too much if they go under - what I really lament is that there aren't any local shops anymore. |
Another casualty of the internet. There is no way a local shop can compete with B&H and the other online shops. |
My local camera shop is thriving, in fact, in the last few years, they've expanded and added another location.
Their prices are close enough to B&H's that, once you consider shipping vs. sales tax, the premium for getting it immediately from them is very small, or non-existent.
They also have a significant internet operation. |
Who is your local shop? We've lost a few in Detroit in the last year or so (Century Camera) and there was just an announcement in Saturday's paper that said Adray Appliance/Camera was closing it's doors ... I'm heading down to Adray on Thurs to see what kind of deals they've got ... |
Norman Camera |
Norman Camera is one of the online shops I always check when I'm about to make a purchase - they have good prices and their cs is excellent! It seems that they have figured out the correct formula for surviving in competition to B&H and others.
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02/24/2009 02:35:06 PM · #12 |
competition is competition no matter how you slice it.
less overhead for the online retailers might mean lower prices for the consumer. sooo, the smaller shops need to cater to the service end of things. know their stuff, be helpful, and also have what you're looking for in stock.
you'll never win over every person that walks through the door, but the ones you do will likely be as loyal as is feasible.
as far the two ritz near me - i've not once had someone tend to me that knew more than i did, they have rarely had what i was looking for in stock, and when you are looking to spend $600+ on something and have to wait 20 minutes to be told it will be a week for them to order it, while someone is asking questions about why their prints aren't right... well.
you look elsewhere.
i was once told they price match, then was told they don't against online retailers like b&h. however ritz has it's own online store... go figure ?
Message edited by author 2009-02-24 14:35:28.
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02/24/2009 12:59:06 PM · #13 |
Originally posted by pamelasue:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Originally posted by FireBird:
Originally posted by OdysseyF22:
I dunno, I guess I won't care too much if they go under - what I really lament is that there aren't any local shops anymore. |
Another casualty of the internet. There is no way a local shop can compete with B&H and the other online shops. |
My local camera shop is thriving, in fact, in the last few years, they've expanded and added another location.
Their prices are close enough to B&H's that, once you consider shipping vs. sales tax, the premium for getting it immediately from them is very small, or non-existent.
They also have a significant internet operation. |
Who is your local shop? We've lost a few in Detroit in the last year or so (Century Camera) and there was just an announcement in Saturday's paper that said Adray Appliance/Camera was closing it's doors ... I'm heading down to Adray on Thurs to see what kind of deals they've got ... |
Norman Camera |
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02/24/2009 12:37:31 PM · #14 |
If other companies start to do this, it will be the importers next, yes, that means Canon USA and Nikon USA. The debt of Ritz to Nikon is 20% of the expected turnover. But since sales are declining it will hit Nikon and Canon extra hard...
So if say Adorama is next... And a couple of small ones.... You will have these importers hit by huge declines in sales + 50% of last years turnover not paid for. I wonder if they can take that hit.
And this crisis will have a long lasting effect. Think 10 to 40 years. Most of us are losing money now and you will have to pay more tax or other levies the next decades to pay for the government interference at this moment. Not only the US but every country on this earth.
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02/24/2009 12:26:04 PM · #15 |
Isn't that bizarre? It seems that two of our area camera shops are the same way. We have a shop 10 minutes from here, and I honestly have made a big effort to go there first when I'm making new purchases. Unfortunately, I almost always end up heading home and heading to B&H on the computer afterward. They just seem to be stuck in the film world with antiquated equipment in stock. I'm sure there are still people out there who use film and appreciate what they offer, but surely they'd be doing themselves a big favor to move into current times.
There's another big shop in Pittsburgh that has virtually nothing relevant in stock, even when they're listed as being a distributor for various products. They drive me insane! They'll always tell me they can order things and have them in a few days... well... uh... so can I!
Originally posted by karmat:
...their biggest downfall is that they almost refuse to acknowledge digital. |
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02/24/2009 10:50:33 AM · #16 |
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Originally posted by FireBird:
Originally posted by OdysseyF22:
I dunno, I guess I won't care too much if they go under - what I really lament is that there aren't any local shops anymore. |
Another casualty of the internet. There is no way a local shop can compete with B&H and the other online shops. |
My local camera shop is thriving, in fact, in the last few years, they've expanded and added another location.
Their prices are close enough to B&H's that, once you consider shipping vs. sales tax, the premium for getting it immediately from them is very small, or non-existent.
They also have a significant internet operation. |
Who is your local shop? We've lost a few in Detroit in the last year or so (Century Camera) and there was just an announcement in Saturday's paper that said Adray Appliance/Camera was closing it's doors ... I'm heading down to Adray on Thurs to see what kind of deals they've got ... |
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02/24/2009 10:29:15 AM · #17 |
Originally posted by FireBird:
Originally posted by OdysseyF22:
I dunno, I guess I won't care too much if they go under - what I really lament is that there aren't any local shops anymore. |
Another casualty of the internet. There is no way a local shop can compete with B&H and the other online shops. |
My local camera shop is thriving, in fact, in the last few years, they've expanded and added another location.
Their prices are close enough to B&H's that, once you consider shipping vs. sales tax, the premium for getting it immediately from them is very small, or non-existent.
They also have a significant internet operation. |
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02/24/2009 10:12:52 AM · #18 |
We have a small local camera shop (well, it is 30 minutes away, in another county, but that is considered local 'round here), and their biggest downfall is that they almost refuse to acknowledge digital. You go into their shop and they have cases full of lenses and film cameras, and one case with 4 digital cameras in it.
They do, however, carry seamless paper, so when I needed that, it was cheaper to pay their slightly higher price because I didn't have to have it shipped to me. |
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02/24/2009 10:04:57 AM · #19 |
Originally posted by OdysseyF22:
I dunno, I guess I won't care too much if they go under - what I really lament is that there aren't any local shops anymore. |
Another casualty of the internet. There is no way a local shop can compete with B&H and the other online shops. There was a slight chance when film and slides were still being processed locally but even that income stream is drying up. When I bought my last brand new film camera (Minolta 900) I got it at a local camera store and probably paid about 20 percent higher than ordering it. I brought most of my slides back to the store to process and bought accessories there. There were enough people doing that then to make it a very profitable enterprise. Our ability to get deals online has destroyed any chance of a local shop where we can play with an actual camera. This is one of the reasons you encounter "attitudes" at stores like Ritz. We all come by to look at a camera or lens, play with it, mount it on our camera, but then we hand it back, go home and order it from B&H. So no wonder they don't want to bother reaching behind the glass to show us anything.
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02/24/2009 09:20:40 AM · #20 |
Originally posted by SDW:
Originally posted by Phillydigishooter:
I always thought Ritz was overpriced. |
We have two WolfCamera stores here and both are within a mile of my home. They are overpriced and only stock mid-line lens. The don't stock any f/2.8 lens, mostly kit lens. The only thing I liked about the store were the local printing when I needed a large print or bulk print. |
One is over there my monkey joes, where is the other one? |
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02/24/2009 08:14:30 AM · #21 |
I'd never think of buying a body/good lens from Ritz simply because I've never found their prices to be that good (often much higher than I can find elsewhere), and, as has been mentioned before, they're usually staffed by idiots.
On the other hand, I do use them quite a bit for accessories - filters, caps, remotes, and the like. Their "Quantaray by Cokin" filters area great - essentially just Cokin filters with a different name on them for half the price. And their Quantaray flashes aren't too bad, either, if you need something simple.
But then, the first time I ordered from them online they held up my order until I called to confirm it (it was a $30 order). I was pissed at the delay and read the CS agent a real riot act, and have never had them insist that I call again.
I dunno, I guess I won't care too much if they go under - what I really lament is that there aren't any local shops anymore. When I was at university we had one across from the campus, but in four years it went from stocking everything to stocking next to nothing to closing. Where I live now, there's not a single camera shop (Ritz excluded) within 2 hours driving time, at least.
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02/24/2009 06:46:58 AM · #22 |
Just out of curiosity, how many of y'all went to a local store to touch test equipment, then bought online?
How many of you have used the small, knowledgeable pro shops?
Like I said, I have used them, but I find it difficult as that's where I get the high-handed attitude.....which makes no sense as far as customer retention goes.
I won't alienate the one that has been reasonably decent to me, but they just don't seem to be eager for my business, either.
Message edited by author 2009-02-24 06:47:25.
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02/24/2009 03:55:55 AM · #23 |
I live in a cesspool for photography. There used to be a shop around dedicated to photographers in town but then a few years back it closed it's doors. Then there was another shop, which decided that scuba diving in Colorado was more lucrative. I'm not kidding- changed over to pure scuba, and still open. Sorta tells the tale of things I guess. There is a Ritz here that is terrible. Last time I was in, I don't think they even had a brand other than Quantaray, but they assured me they could "order anything." Bodies were lacking too, with only Rebels and D40x's. I can't really expect a whole lot, because it's a dinky shop in a now failing mall. My other choice is to drive an hour to Denver or to go to a local outdoors store that stocks good equipment at higher prices, and alternately has dunces and pretentious know it alls that don't actually know much at all for customer service (in the photography department and elsewhere as well...). Last time I went to see if they had a PC sync cord because I couldn't wait to have one shipped in, and given the look I received, I might as well have been speaking Korean, even after I carefully explained what it was and what it was used for.
The bummer is when local specialized shops go under. When a company like Circuit City goes under, I'm not too upset because they are jerkoffs anyway, but when smaller shops with real customer service and specialists goes under, then it's upsetting. Luckily things locally aren't quite as grim for my other expensive and time consuming hobby-mountianeering/backpacking, but I think that's just because the mountains are in my backyard. |
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02/23/2009 11:18:55 PM · #24 |
Originally posted by ambaker:
Originally posted by delin:
Darwin in action. They are positioned between Big Boxes/Walmart/Costco and high end retail/internet. Tough place to stay alive,seems like a temporary market to me. I did get my Sigma wide angle from them, same $ as the internet and I had it in my hand that day. But they really knew nothing about it. Too bad we can't have the best of both- price, convenience, knowledge, community, moral fulfilment........ |
The problem is that knowledge costs money. To get knowledgeable help, you have to pay them more. Too many times people come in, ask the pros for all the info to help them make their decision, then go down the street or onto the internet, and buy the equipment for bottom dollar. Then they wonder where the good shops went.
The rest, good customer service, honesty, etc. should not cost extra. |
Yup, exactly. The question is, what is the ultimate answer? That's the future of the photography industry. Value vs. $. Glad it's not my problem. |
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02/23/2009 11:07:43 PM · #25 |
Originally posted by delin:
Darwin in action. They are positioned between Big Boxes/Walmart/Costco and high end retail/internet. Tough place to stay alive,seems like a temporary market to me. I did get my Sigma wide angle from them, same $ as the internet and I had it in my hand that day. But they really knew nothing about it. Too bad we can't have the best of both- price, convenience, knowledge, community, moral fulfilment........ |
The problem is that knowledge costs money. To get knowledgeable help, you have to pay them more. Too many times people come in, ask the pros for all the info to help them make their decision, then go down the street or onto the internet, and buy the equipment for bottom dollar. Then they wonder where the good shops went.
The rest, good customer service, honesty, etc. should not cost extra.
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